Hmm

[TheMagic]

A thought that just came up in my mind..

Many people consider Thomas Edison one of the smartest men who ever lived, who here thinks they're smarter than Edison?

Thomas Edison was a Deist, so according to some people since he believed in religion he's one of the stupidest "things" to have ever lived?

[Seragath]

science without religion is boring. Religion without science is blind.

[Telrander]

All science does is make a fool of itself by trying to prove God wrong. You can't prove God wrong cause he is always right. He is the Light of Truth and the One Supreme Being, science can't compete with him no matter how hard the Devil tries to.

[Seragath]

All science does is make a fool of itself by trying to prove God wrong. You can't prove God wrong cause he is always right. He is the Light of Truth and the One Supreme Being, science can't compete with him no matter how hard the Devil tries to.

And without us you would still believe that god lived in the skies, and we would be the center of the universe. If god is so almighty as you say. Can he then create a rock so big that he cannot carry it himself ? If so, he's not almighty at all.

Oh here is another quote for you

"You want a creator who's filled this earth with species, since life began, 99% of which are extinct already. This is some design, isn't it ? Now, you're a believer, is that where it stops, or do you think this creator cares about you too ?" - Christopher Hithcens

[expo]

And without us you would still believe that god lived in the skies, and we would be the center of the universe. If god is so almighty as you say. Can he then create a rock so big that he cannot carry it himself ? If so, he's not almighty at all.

Oh here is another quote for you

"You want a creator who's filled this earth with species, since life began, 99% of which are extinct already. This is some design, isn't it ? Now, you're a believer, is that where it stops, or do you think this creator cares about you too ?" - Christopher Hithcens

Science and religion need each other. Only idiots on either side of the parabola disagree with this. Those at the middle see the necessity in both and are capable of co-existing.

[Seragath]

Science and religion need each other. Only idiots on either side of the parabola disagree with this. Those at the middle see the necessity in both and are capable of co-existing.

And where do you see me?

[expo]

And where do you see me?

Leaning a little towards full-on science. But you are practically in the middled compared to Syke and matt who are just about read to fall off the graph with Telandar.

[Seragath]

Leaning a little towards full-on science. But you are practically in the middled compared to Syke and matt who are just about read to fall off the graph with Telandar.

Hehe. Well we all have our ground somewhere.

[nexusoblivion]

thomas edison eh.... funny thin about edison.....
"All bibles are man made"-thomas edison :^/ he may have been a believer in a higher power but he sure as hell didnt subscribe to any christian doctorine... and yes science and religion are symbiotic :P

[mattatheos]

Leaning a little towards full-on science. But you are practically in the middled compared to Syke and matt who are just about read to fall off the graph with Telandar.

I don't hate religion and I'm not some kind of fanatic, I just don't really agree with Christianity. Although that still makes me a heathen and infidel and fanatic in your eyes.

thomas edison eh.... funny thin about edison.....
"All bibles are man made"-thomas edison :^/ he may have been a believer in a higher power but he sure as hell didnt subscribe to any christian doctorine... and yes science and religion are symbiotic :P

Except for all the time science has gone against religion and proved it wrong.

[Syke]

Leaning a little towards full-on science. But you are practically in the middled compared to Syke and matt who are just about read to fall off the graph with Telandar.

I feel I've accomplished something, to warrant the usage of my name as an example when I'm not even hanging around this thread.

Anyway, I don't despise everyone who doesn't accept science as a religion... I just hate those fanatical dicks who are all to excited to not buy into something that we actually know to be true versus something that is little more than text on a page.

[mattatheos]

I feel I've accomplished something, to warrant the usage of my name as an example when I'm not even hanging around this thread.

Anyway, I don't despise everyone who doesn't accept science as a religion... I just hate those fanatical dicks who are all to excited to not buy into something that we actually know to be true versus something that is little more than text on a page.

I think we are being called fanatical because we don't believe in Christianity because, you know, that's the definition. If you don't believe in Christianity you just MUST be fanatical and insane, there just MUST be something wrong with you.

[expo]

I don't hate religion and I'm not some kind of fanatic, I just don't really agree with Christianity. Although that still makes me a heathen and infidel and fanatic in your eyes.

See, you again show your preconceived notions without me having to say anything. Have you once seen my call you a heathen, infidel, or fanatic? No, but I do think you are quite unintelligent because you act like you know what my opinions of everything are.

Anyway, I don't despise everyone who doesn't accept science as a religion... I just hate those fanatical dicks who are all to excited to not buy into something that we actually know to be true versus something that is little more than text on a page.

This is a distinct difference between you and mattatheos. She follows the mainstream anti-Christianity hate groups while you actually give reason and at least semi-unbiased information. You give a reason, she just spouts off random shit that seldomly makes sense.

I think we are being called fanatical because we don't believe in Christianity because, you know, that's the definition. If you don't believe in Christianity you just MUST be fanatical and insane, there just MUST be something wrong with you.

What dictionary did you get that definition from? I couldn't find it on Merriam-Webster or Oxford.

[mattatheos]

Well you are just so fast to call me a fanatic, I'm fine with all religions besides Christianity and all of its branches and you think that makes me fanatical.

[expo]

Well you are just so fast to call me a fanatic, I'm fine with all religions besides Christianity and all of its branches and you think that makes me fanatical.

Wrong again. I did a forum search for fanatic and any time I posted with it. Funny how the only time it found that word was when I quoted other people. I have no clue why you like any religion but Christianity because you haven't given a clear reason why beyond "ZOMF THOSE EVIL CHRISTIANS ARE ALWAYS KILLING!!1!11!". Can you tell me what else I thought?

[ender95]

OOO i want to put my two sense in to the conversation above. The marker kid is right. You just can't put words in his or her mouth. They never once called you fanaticle, at least not that I could find. How ever, I think you are fanaticle. You keep on ranting on how bad Christianity is. They way I look at it is all religions are similar. They all believe in a intity that is all powerful. I haven't seen proof so i can't agree with any religion yet.

[nexusoblivion]

mattatheos... I love you....

ok any ways, hating one singular religion is kind of pointless... hating any religion is pointless really... I mean if you don't agree with it then don't follow it, its really not that complicated, having contempt for a thing though is a bit well.... daft to be blunt, I hate fundamentalist Christians, I don't hate their doctrine... why hate any thing that can give you insight into why people behave the way they do and in the same way can give you a tool to use against those you hate.... I thought atheists were supposed to be logical? know your enemies....

and the Christian may be full of fallacy but like any thing else it has its high points, notions like don't kill don't rape don't betray... etc... yeah other then implied metaphorical value its a load of garbage but it has its high points...

and yeah science has disproved religion to an extent but religion has preformed a necessary job in science of giving science something to disprove, or rather... hmm... how do I put this.... well...

allot of the research in science done by Christians is in search of god in science seeking scientific evidence of god, and while that is going on other discoveries are being made.... though I think pagans could of done a better job with it....

[mattatheos]

mattatheos... I love you....

is it safe to assume that that is sarcastic and an attempt to mock or insult me too or is there actually something I did to win your favor?

allot of the research in science done by Christians is in search of god in science seeking scientific evidence of god, and while that is going on other discoveries are being made.... though I think pagans could of done a better job with it....

Pagans could have done a better job with what?

And yeah, your right nexus, maybe I should learn more about Christianity if just so that I can learn tolerance for it, like you said I don't have to like it to tolerate it.

Oh, if only expo were as nice as you are lol

[nexusoblivion]

it kinda was and wasnt sarcasm, I dont agree with all of your perspectives I find your perspectives tend to be both naive and informed.... I'd like to say your at a point in your life where your coming into a better understanding of things but still grasping at origional understandings of things but that may be an early assumption and I just find the whole process enjoyable and some of the things you say seem like jumping to conclusions which is just adorable so... yeah lol I think the points made....

I say pagans could of done a better job with sciences because they not only have a broader perspective but they were the first scientists, alchemy = a more brutish form of chemistry, while every other theoligies were writing things on paper and ruling the lower class pagans were researching, expiramenting and inventing new ways to well... to put it bluntly and metaphorically.... blow shit up

and I didnt say you should learn tolerance for christianity, nothing wrong with christianity, every one has to decide for them selves what they believe in and for some thats christianity, the problem is people that take it way to far and put way to much stock into it the ones you'll often notice me calling "fundies" fundamentalistic christians

ie the over zealous arrogant bastards that think their the only ones that are right and want every one else int he world to act the way that they do

[Seragath]

mattatheos... I love you....

ok any ways, hating one singular religion is kind of pointless... hating any religion is pointless really... I mean if you don't agree with it then don't follow it, its really not that complicated, having contempt for a thing though is a bit well.... daft to be blunt, I hate fundamentalist Christians, I don't hate their doctrine... why hate any thing that can give you insight into why people behave the way they do and in the same way can give you a tool to use against those you hate.... I thought atheists were supposed to be logical? know your enemies....

and the Christian may be full of fallacy but like any thing else it has its high points, notions like don't kill don't rape don't betray... etc... yeah other then implied metaphorical value its a load of garbage but it has its high points...

and yeah science has disproved religion to an extent but religion has preformed a necessary job in science of giving science something to disprove, or rather... hmm... how do I put this.... well...

allot of the research in science done by Christians is in search of god in science seeking scientific evidence of god, and while that is going on other discoveries are being made.... though I think pagans could of done a better job with it....

Religion is a very powerful tool, if used by the right people. I agree on you with that Hating one religion is quite useless. But on the other hand you hate some things more than others. Same goes for religion. I normally just Ignore religion as a whole, but when they go after the Children I tend to observe. You should not tell a child for example that he/she should convert now, tomorrow might be too late and he/she'll go to hell and burn for all eternity.
That's taking it way too far.

[nexusoblivion]

no child should be taught any theologies, the should be given the options and an open mind should be promoted for growth

[mattatheos]

it kinda was and wasnt sarcasm, I dont agree with all of your perspectives I find your perspectives tend to be both naive and informed.... I'd like to say your at a point in your life where your coming into a better understanding of things but still grasping at origional understandings of things but that may be an early assumption and I just find the whole process enjoyable and some of the things you say seem like jumping to conclusions which is just adorable so... yeah lol I think the points made....

Adorable? Why, sir, you've just made this young lady blush hehehe :o

no child should be taught any theologies, the should be given the options and an open mind should be promoted for growth

I wonder how many people would choose any religion at all in this day and age if they were given their own choice with no outside forces trying to sway them. Like if they never ran into religion whatsoever in their lfie and then could choose something at age 12 or something like that.

[nexusoblivion]

naa they should be exposed to it but not pushed into it, they shouldnt be taught what to believe, they should be taught to be open minded and shown the diffrent belief systems and perspectives to make their own informed decisions.. .. sorry, I shoulda been more specific the first time lol.....

[mattatheos]

That almost sounds like what the Amish do except I don't think the Amish expose their children to all the different belief systems, just their own.

[nexusoblivion]

yeah i really dont know what to make of the amish... their just odd not the same spectrum of thought, I'm sure the simple life of work has its benefits but my curiousity would get the better of me if I was born into that type of community

[mattatheos]

yeah i really dont know what to make of the amish... their just odd not the same spectrum of thought, I'm sure the simple life of work has its benefits but my curiousity would get the better of me if I was born into that type of community

That's why they have the Rumspringaa (or something like that.) People ages 16 - 18 (around there) are allowed to leave the community and live their life without concerning themselves about the rules of their religion. If, during this time, they discover a new religion or enjoy life outside of the community more then living within the Amish community they are allowed to leave, no strings attached. By giving their young people this kind of freedom of exploration, they are able to get all of their "wild side" urges out of the way. Over 65% of children on a Rumspringaa choose to remain within the community and take their baptism pledge to the Amish church and community.

[Syke]

The Amish are still living in the 18th century...

[nexusoblivion]

yeah but thats not really a fair shot, they only know 1 way to live untill 16? really the optimal curiousity phase in a persons life is like 12-14 for your typical simple person thats when they learn the most, any point after that is usualy dedicated to the use of said information 14-20ish is usualy that whole you cant tell me cause I know every thing phase..... yeah people need to conciously and intentionally place them selves in a constant state of learning after they go through those phases or they fall into ignorance (this is of course a gneneralized statement which isn't inclusive to most of the forum) really I think it'd be more fair to expose them to society at a younger age.... I think you'd find that if they actually learned from the real world they'd never go back because curiousity and complexity would pull out their desire for that barn raising crap.....

[mattatheos]

I never thought about that, but I'm sure the Amish have. 14 - 20 is like the heavy rebel phases so they send their children out into the real world and away from their fragile society. And I'm sure they do the Rumspringaa around that time to keep their religion alive, like you said if they knew about civilization earlier they wouldn't stay and followers are the blood of a religion and the communities way of life so they need to keep their children within the community.

[nexusoblivion]

I dont think rebellious teenagers is really an issue in the community because their just as strict as we would of been pre-electric age... which means a disobedient child is a beaten child

[Syke]

I find it stupid how any Amish who decide they want to be a part of the rest of the world are shunned by their families.

[nexusoblivion]

eh is to be expected with ignorance

[mattatheos]

To the Amish, it is like turning your back on your friends, your family, your neighbors, your community, your church and your God. If you don't want to be part of their community then they don't want you to be part of theirs I guess.

[nexusoblivion]

eh kinda is what it has to be all things considered, but still I think they should permit those that leave to visit, seems kinda harsh they wouldnt allow it

[mattatheos]

They fear that ex-members of the community might come in and preach of the luxurys and advantages of a modern world and take all of their followers away. If someone loves the outside world more then the community, then they can stay there and live their life as they please just as long as they don't bring it back into the community with them. I don't think people who go on their Rumspringaa and return to the community are allowed to speak of their time outside in the modern world.

[nexusoblivion]

I dont agree with your reasoning in their logic, I think its simple they believe the person has been corrupted and they dont want the corruption t spread, I dont think they see it as complexly as you put it. as for wether or nto their permited to talk about it is not something I'd know, supose I should look into it but honestly... I dont really care lol :P

[mattatheos]

they believe the person has been corrupted and they dont want the corruption t spread

Yeah, isn't that what I said? lol

[Syke]

They have some issues. They call us (the "outsiders") English and act like they want no part of us. I think we stopped being English right around the time when the Colonial Army won the Revolutionary War. Not only that but the Amish come from the same gene pool, so the differences between the "English" and the Amish aren't even physical...

[mattatheos]

They have some issues. They call us (the "outsiders") English and act like they want no part of us. I think we stopped being English right around the time when the Colonial Army won the Revolutionary War. Not only that but the Amish come from the same gene pool, so the differences between the "English" and the Amish aren't even physical...

Yeah, their small gene pools make them so heavily prone to genetic disorders and rare blood types.

[nexusoblivion]

Yeah, their small gene pools make them so heavily prone to genetic disorders and rare blood types.

I'm quoting that because it feeds into my genetics theory :D

any ways, yeah matth it is what you said but like I said I dont think they see it as complicated as we do, they see it more simply as keeping corruption out.

as for our genetic similarities well... we aree pretty much from the same stock with minor diffrences... but for the most part we're all anglo-saxons